Xxavier
Established Member

These articles Here and Here highlight different modes of arguing. MRAs are modernists; feminists are postmodernists.

Here are some of the characteristics of each:

Modern discourse
• "personal detachment from the issues under discussion," the separation of participants' personal identities from subjects of inquiry and topics of debate;
• values on "confidence, originality, agonism, independence of thought, creativity, assertiveness, the mastery of one’s feelings, a thick skin and high tolerance for your own and others’ discomfort";
• suited to a heterotopic space like a university class, scholarly journal, or session of a learned society conference, a place apart much like a playing field for sports events, where competitors engage in ritual combat before returning with a handshake to the realm of friendly, personal interaction;
• illustrated by debate in the British House of Commons;
• epitomized by the debates a century ago between socialist G. B. Shaw and distributist G. K. Chesterton;
• playfulness is legitimate: one can play devil’s advocate, speak tongue in cheek, overstate and use hyperbole, the object being not to capture the truth in a single, balanced monologue, but to expose the strengths and weaknesses of various positions;
• "scathing satire and sharp criticism" are also legitimate;
• the best ideas are thought to emerge from mutual, merciless probing and attacking of arguments, with resultant exposure of blindspots in vision, cracks in theories, inconsistencies in logic;
• participants are forced again and again to return to the drawing board and produce better arguments;
• the truth is understood not to be located in any single voice, but to emerge from the conversation as a whole.

Postmodern discourse
• "persons and positions are ordinarily closely related," with little insistence on keeping personal identity separate from the questions or issues under discussion;
• "sensitivity, inclusivity, and inoffensiveness are key values";
• priority on "cooperation, collaboration, quietness, sedentariness, empathy, equality, non-competitiveness, conformity, a communal focus";
• "seems lacking in rationality and ideological challenge," in the eyes of proponents of modern discourse;
• tends to perceive the satire and criticism of modern discourse as "vicious and personal attack, driven by a hateful animus";
• is oriented to " the standard measures of grades, tests, and a closely defined curriculum";
• lacking "means by which to negotiate or accommodate such intractable differences within its mode of conversation," it will "typically resort to the most fiercely antagonistic, demonizing, and personal attacks upon the opposition";
• "will typically try, not to answer opponents with better arguments, but to silence them completely as ‘hateful’, ‘intolerant’, ‘bigoted’, ‘misogynistic’, ‘homophobic’, etc.";
• has a more feminine flavour, as opposed to the more masculine flavour of modern discourse;
• results in "stale monologues" and contexts that "seldom produce strong thought, but rather tend to become echo chambers."

TL;DR: Modern discourse is a method of evaluating the truth. Postmodern discourse is a method to enforce conformity in the in-group and to separate the in-group from the out-group.

This a collection of quotes and posts from comments sections to articles that have struck a chord with me.





We cannot mistake absolutism for principle, or substitute spectacle for politics, or treat name-calling as reasoned debate (Anon)

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Being a “victim” can be intoxicating to some.

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Facts don't bullying.

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A Man who doesn't want to be a parent to his child is called a Dead Beat Dad. A Woman is called Pro Choice.

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The core question of men's studies throughout America is "Why are men so awful?"

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History is full of atrocities carried out in the service of a moral agenda. Prof. Murray Straus.

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Engineering, Computer Science and Physics; a more accurate term than "male dominated" would be "female shunned".

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If your drinks are free, then you are one of the things the bar is selling

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There are few bigger threats to free speech and freedom than a dedicated liberal activist.

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We are culturally predisposed towards focusing on women.

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"Minister of Equality" - A concept Orwell would have been proud of.

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When words loose their meaning, people will loose their liberty. - Confucius

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A lie repeated often enough will become to be believed as true.

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A lie travels faster and further than the truth.

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Wallowing in self righteous anger is intellectually lazy and self indulgent.

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Inequality will exist as long as liberty exists. It unavoidably results from that very liberty itself.
(Alexander. Hamilton, 1787)

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Amanda Marcotte is one of the posterchildren for "if all you've got is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail."

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Feminism has failed the working class.

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"Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Feminism is a bourgeois movement that uses working class women to look after their children while they go off and fulfill themselves.

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Would you trust the White Nationalist Party if they declared it their goal to achieve equality for the races?

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What kind of ‘debate’ is it where, as soon as feminist clichés are uttered, the discourse becomes a monologue and they must be heard in respectful silence?

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Being led by a liberal elite, completely disconnected from the lives of the rest of us makes you realise how utterly illiberal, liberalism is.

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Man hating is a national sport.

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The ultimate deadbeat parent is a Mom who aborts her child because parenthood was inconvenient.

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Feminism is a partisan interest group that is prepared to harm boy's education or father's rights or whatever else if it suits their objectives.

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Language is important, people had get better as realizing that. Cultural Marxists specialize in creating, removing and redefining words. They attack the supply lines of the enemy.

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Phrases to die for:-
... hyperbolic and deceptive language.
....recreational crying.
....petty tyrants
... Astroturf

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