For Chev and TMOTS

[Percy]

I will settle for an apology, as I said.

[chevalier]

Well you aren't getting one. So don't hold your breath. Unless of course you are into that sort of thing.

[Missy-A]

[Yan Yan]

Well Missy, you couldn't have picked a worse video if you want to be peacemaker.

The tacky, sugar-coated American content is bound to annoy Percy.

The assumption that worshiping women is all it takes for all men to get along, is bound to annoy Chev.

You give them both further ammunition like some international arms dealer. What exactly was the point of that?

[Missy-A]

Well Missy, you couldn't have picked a worse video if you want to be peacemaker.

The tacky, sugar-coated American content is bound to annoy Percy.

The assumption that worshiping women is all it takes for all men to get along, is bound to annoy Chev.

You give them both further ammunition like some international arms dealer. What exactly was the point of that?

Ammunition? Please, calm down. It was only a joke, to make light of the situation. I've made it a point to talk to almost every member of this board, I am in good terms with both. This means, I know my limits with both Chev and Percy - they understand my intent is not to annoy.

But, what is your intent? I recommend breathing exercises for you.

Have a great day!

[Yan Yan]

It was only a joke, to make light of the situation.

I'd love to know if either of them found it amusing.

This means, I know my limits with both Chev and Percy

Ahhh! So you expect them to suspend their animosity, temporarily, so that they may both humor you.

But, what is your intent? I recommend breathing exercises for you.

By the way, I'm perfectly calm. I don't take kindly to being patronized but I can deal with it. I recommend going abroad for you. Venturing outside your limited world and seeing how most of the world lives, might prove informative.

If you had been successful in annoying me by your patronizing remarks, then perhaps both Percy and Chev would fly to your aid and forget their differences? They are both good men but sorely tempted by a revival of misguided chivalry.

Maybe they will both fall out with me for that last suggestion.

Have a great day too!

[Marx]

At this point in time, everyone's falling out with everyone else.

[James Huff]

Interesting...
I can understand a sense of nationalism....I think I have pointed my opinion out on this in other posts. And that is all I need to say to say about that. If I think this way, and they think that way, then that is all there is to it. What we have here is a failure to communicate......about the relevant issues as they relate to MISANDRY across Western Culture, and the encroachment of institutionalized misandry paid for by the taxes of men.

[chevalier]

Yan Yan I think misguided chivalry is really at the core of Percy's anger at me at the moment.

All of this anger started with what some PM's exchanged between Percy and I regarding his desire for me to be nice to Tera.

He said I should ignore her words as they are merely words on a screen yet e seems to have lost the ability to apply that same logic regarding me.

When dear Tera calls us all names and makes disparaging remarks about all of us we are apparently supposed to be nice to her.

But when I point out Percy's Anti American attitude then all bets are off and he demands an apology.

I think Tera has sunk her devious little claws into Percy very deeply.

Tera is probably laughing her ass off right now as her desires have come to fruition.

Percy will not get an apology nor will Tera.

I will respond to their future posts as I do everyone else's.

If the post is worthy of praise I will give it.

If it is worthy of a written smack down they will get that as well.

As always it is on a post by post basis.

[Marx]

Guys, as JH hinted at... we're here to investigate misandry and it's sources, not cultural opinions. I know I've been guilty too in the past, but I have reigned myself in on it a long, long time back.

[Percy]

This has nothing to do with Tera or anyone else., Chev.

It is about you calumnising me as anti-american.

Nothing else.

[PWCM]

This has nothing to do with Tera or anyone else., Chev.

It is about you calumnising me as anti-american.

Nothing else.

So what are you really saying Percy, that you're not Anti American as a race of people, but you are Anti American Politics.

Myself I am Anti American Politics, Anti British Politics, Anti Australian Politics, I hate American Media, I hate Australian Media and I hate British Media.
I have served with Skips and Yanks and on the whole they are f'cking great. I have lived in the States and I am currently living in Australia, and I what I find is that I hate the media bullshit that is so over the top with National Pride. For instance Pommie Bashing, on channel 9 whenever the English come over to play Rugby, Cricket or anything for that matter. You get the f'cking media hyping up anti pommie rhetoric, we are thugs, we are cheat so on and so on. Next thing you know you have given rise to anger and taken the bite, you start to hate the f'cking Skips. Media controls the emotions, we read what they want us to read. Who the f'ck knows if its 100% true...end of the day its us and them, we have the numbers but they rule by divide and conquer.

Chev and yourself are prime examples of what can happen when we make statements based on what has been read or seen. No apologies are needed, we just need to think 'who the f*ck made me feel like this' and find the source.

[Incognito]

Yan Yan I think misguided chivalry is really at the core of Percy's anger at me at the moment.

All of this anger started with what some PM's exchanged between Percy and I regarding his desire for me to be nice to Tera.

He said I should ignore her words as they are merely words on a screen yet e seems to have lost the ability to apply that same logic regarding me.

When dear Tera calls us all names and makes disparaging remarks about all of us we are apparently supposed to be nice to her.

But when I point out Percy's Anti American attitude then all bets are off and he demands an apology.

I think Tera has sunk her devious little claws into Percy very deeply.

Tera is probably laughing her ass off right now as her desires have come to fruition.

Percy will not get an apology nor will Tera.

I will respond to their future posts as I do everyone else's.

If the post is worthy of praise I will give it.

If it is worthy of a written smack down they will get that as well.

As always it is on a post by post basis.

YouTube - ‪Taylor Swift - Mean [lyrics & download]‬‏

[dad_savage]

I'm no diplomat. I don't know if this advice will help. I apologize in advance if it comes off high-handed, or patronizing. I do not meant to interfere; I admit total ignorance of the Tera side of this subject, and am not fully versed in the root of this conflict. Nevertheless I see two men I respect at odds. It grieves me to see, but I would ask you both some questions in the hopes that it may help bring some resolution.

"A person who is opposed to something, such as a group, policy, proposal, or practice," is a definition I get for the term anti. Whether someone appears to oppose something is certainly a quality which can be freely speculated on by outsiders. Whether, by a preponderance of opinion, they have given some indication that they may be opposed to something, an indication which could be taken as evidence which may possibly fail to square with their stated intent is something an outsider might certainly be able to know. I fail to appreciate, on the other hand, how one can know, with certainty, that another is opposed to something without that view being informed by them.

In other words only Percy can know if Percy is opposed to Americans if that opposition is being characterized as a state of being as opposed to an external characterization or impression. And he has said he is not. Now, of course, one might doubt the veracity of such a statement, or even conclude otherwise. If they have reason to doubt his motives. Chev has such reasons, it would seem. I am not here to consider them, but assume, knowing Chev, they are sound. Yet even if his doubt rests on a firm basis, even if that doubt seems undeniable, and we are moved not to accept Percy's statement we can still only guess at what his actual motives are what, his actual attitude, or state-of-being is. Thus if Percy says he is not anti-American we may have reasons to doubt, but unless informed directly by him we cannot conclude he is anti-American. Save as an assumption.

That said, I think Percy's request to be given the benefit of the doubt is fair. To doubt what he says is to open the way toward speculation regarding things which only he can know, and such speculation tends to be insulting, and, between friends, is rarely constructive.

I do not believe he is owed an apology personally, but I ask Chev: can you not accept that his statement, 'I am not anti-American,' is correct, at least, in so far as his private thoughts, mood and mentality (all things which you can only know by second-hand, symbolic inference and have no direct, objective experience of) are concerned? Accept that when Percy thinks of America, or this subject is raised he is driven by no immediate, personal urge to take hostile, or critical action? That he deals with the subject in a fashion which he believes (rightly or wrongly) to be even handed, or which is at the very least a justifiable response to stimulus, input or known fact?

This would not stop you from noting that reasons do exist on which to base a doubtful reaction to his statement. It would not stop you from saying that such a statement (given his record) is something you find difficult to accept. It would not stop you from asking that he attempt to resolve this apparent gulf between his actions and his words. It would take nothing from a conclusion (based on your interactions) that his observable discourse, and visible attitude toward, and known conclusions regarding America, and Americans seems, overwhelmingly or otherwise, offensive, unreasonable, indeed, even hostile, oppositional, etc.
Is this too much?

To Percy I would say that, whether you intend it or not, asking for an apology at this point is a provocative act. It is not constructive. Much has been said, by both of you, which would be better forgotten. I appreciate you may feel like your olive branch has been knocked aside, but try to appreciate that Chev is of the opinion that you have had a lot of negative things to say about his nation, and countrymen. I know you're not trying to about-face by posting this pro-American sentiment, and believe you are in fact attempting to remind him, by way of an example, that you have also said good things of America. If Chev had not already concluded (and let us assume he did not conclude this hastily; based on the fact that we know Chev to be a reasonable person) that such positive sentiment is outweighed decidedly by bad we would not be in this position in the first place. Or in other words a nudge, a suggestion, that he consider the good you have said of the US is not likely to effect much change on his opinion.
Can you not give him the benefit of the doubt in that, and assume he has already weighed the good, and bad, and concluded (rightly or wrongly, but not unreasonably and certainly on a basis which to him must seem sound, and which we cannot simply dismiss) in spite of the good that the bad is all too much?

Give him the benefit of the doubt that he has not flown off the handle. I do not believe Chev takes any joy in this, or thinks it amusing in any way. I doubt having come to believe you have strong, negative feelings towards his fellow citizens causes him anything but grief. And I am certain he is aware of the offence you might take, and thus has not chosen his position lightly.

Perhaps if you (Percy) acknowledge that Chev has been offended by things you have said, and (I'm not asking either of you to apologize) consider it well. Accepting that he is a decent chap, who would not react this way over nothing, concede that you will meditate on, and consider your attitude toward the US. Attempt to see 'from outside,' how certain people might find it offensive. It may be that, having done this, you will discover a better way to express you beliefs and attitudes on this subject.

[chevalier]

Dad how many times am I to give the benefit of the doubt? This is not the first time this has come up. Nor the second nor the third.

I have offered to let it drop repeatedly.

If Percy feels he is not anti American then fine.

But I will not change my mind as I have seen evidence too many times.

And now he is demanding an apology? He equated me to his ex wife and basically called me a feminist yet he wants an apology?

I have said numerous times that I am willing to agree to disagree and drop this whole thing.

He responds to me with insults and demands not the other way around.

Did I ask him to admit he has anti American bias? No I didn't.

Did I compare him to my ex wife? No I didn't.

Did I call him a feminist? No I didn't.

Percy is continuing this.

And Percy I already explained the connection with Tera. All of this started right after I refused to let Tera run around calling us all misogyinsts and having tantrums.

And you have responded in the very manner you told me I should refrain from.

I still have the PM's if you need a reminder of what you said.

Words on a screen remember Percy.

Apparently your advice only applies to me and not to yourself. And definately not to poor sweet Tera.

YouTube - ‪Taylor Swift - Mean [lyrics & download]‬‏

Tera your video is a discription of you not me. This is one thread where I am not getting along with someone. How many threads have you angered people on with your shit stirring, name calling and utter bullshit?

Nice try but only you and Percy are going to fall for that.

I am not the aggressor here.

oh btw you are butting in to this private public thread between Percy and I. Remember when you said that to me? Why is it ok for to intrude? Hypocrite.