The one's I have encountered have only served to give MRA's a bad name... they use vulgar language and get angry if you don't agree with every word they speak - this has happened on this very site.

Hi Marx, yeah, I noticed some ofthe posts on this site, jesus, it was as though some women haters were using the material to attack women. The David Deangelo stuff I used 95% of the time talks about "on being a man". He belieives that if you have learned to be a "man" then you dont need pick up lines, and he warns people about being ethical. PUA materials are very powerful and one has to learn how to respect it and use it wisely, otherwise men just end up hurting women, who then become the new recruits to man-hating feminism.

I dislike PUAs they tend to be dicks of the worst kind.

Some are. That's like saying all those into kinky sex are wierd - and I am sure some indeed are.

PUA's materials it a bit like a gun, it is neutral - the iditobehind the gun determines the nature of the gun, I guess you met some gunhappy rednecks.

I would challange you to get some RSD or David Deangelo DVD's and listen to it and formulate your opinion based on the actual material

I have yet to hear of alternative ways/schools of educating men how to be men and how to go about meeting women, unless we listen to feminist how bad we are.

I think PUA's are useful in demonstrating the false-innocence and double lives of women--where otherwise the culture assumes women women are good, pure, caring, and deserving of protection. Surprise surprise! Ms. sweet heart will in fact let an asshole into her pants if he promises a good time.

And just other things than that. The issue of dating and female sexuality and others things is very complicated. But I think PUA's are useful in demonstrating the immoral animal side to women.

That said these are often the "rough" type of men who will stab you in the back--so they aren't really useful to an organization trying to push for the rights of men. They tend to be more interested in p***y (I write vulgarly to be in line with their essential vulgarity).

Women still enlist the help of men with the pedalling of this image of innocence and vulnerablity. It's becoming more and more laughable to see them do this, what with the reality being seen increasingly in the culture every day. A guy who still buys it in this day and age is a gushy, fruity idiot. If he distances himself from it and thinks: "Hey, it's women's lib and I'm all for equality!" He probably hasn't seen divorce yet or been cheated on (or maybe he has a cuckoldry fetish).

My favorite statistic from this semester's Human Sexuality class: In America, 10% cuckoldry rate (that means that 1 in 10 guys thinks his child is his--WHEN IT'S NOT.

Second favorite statistic: 41% of the women in my class reported having once cheated on their primary partner.

To my mind, PUA's demonstrate this one, important thing: There is no reason to spare women from frontline combat, many of them will prove excellent killers.

Male soldiers--who can be expected to be among those who resist female integration of all levels of the armed forces--should wake up, smell the coffee, and remember that MILITARY WIVES ARE NOTORIOUS ADULTERERS. While you're acting the part of noble, chivalrous desert hero, your wife is likely back home perverting the conjugal bed with another man. You're trash--the male in this society is trash--wake up to it and be pissed man.

Here's a good article on misandry with references to "the Venusian arts". It quite long, but a good read.

The Futurist: The Misandry Bubble

My favorite statistic from this semester's Human Sexuality class: In America, 10% cuckoldry rate (that means that 1 in 10 guys thinks his child is his--WHEN IT'S NOT.

Only 10%? In the UK the rate is an average 15%, and in some deprived areas double that.

If you want to read about this, follow up evolutionary psychology - women are programmed to look for "Mr Good Genes", if he can play the role of "Mr provider" then even better, if not some other sucker will do. Its nothing personal, it biology. Good PUA schools talk about this trap.

The "one honest parter for life" model is an illusion, and always was. It comes as a shock, but we need to accept biology and stop utting women on a pedastol and worshipping them - and again, this is a message of PUA's, but alas, some take it as a message to mistreat women. Treat women with respect, as you would any other person, and expect respect back, prepare for love and happiness, but remember, things can turn sour, so be ready for that.

If you are a student - have a read of - or find a review - of the book "Sperm Wars" - that really gives a wake up call.

In my humble opinion paternity fraud is digusting and premediated. Such women should be put of a sex offenders register.

I'd say PUA's are foes.
I'd say they are lower than dog shit.
A huge chunk of it is based off dishonesty.

Quote from Richard

That's like saying all those into kinky sex are wierd - and I am sure some indeed are.

We are. Why deny that the fact that I enjoy pain is weird to most people.

Exactly, it was wierd to me as well, until I met a woman who was into that, taught me the ABC, and now I am tolerant and sometimes engage in such activities. What I am sayig is don't judge a book by its cover - this applies to SM or PUA.

It is not the techniques that are bad - they are neutral, but if you can an idiot in SM or PUA the results are disasterous.

Similarly psychiartry can be used to cure people - in Poland, as a newspaper editor, I came across cases where it was used for political torture. So do I say all psychiarty is bad?

Uneeded rant.

Quote from Lady Catherine

Uneeded rant.

Ranty McRant's at it again!!!

I once briefly dabbled in PUA ideas. I signed up for David deAngelo's mailing list for about a month, and I read Neil Strauss' "The Game" from cover to cover. I have found that the most successful PUAs (such as Tucker Max) tend to give off the worst image. But, I know better than to let a few extremists define the whole of a group. I mainly like PUAs because they piss off feminists no end. I can't help but wonder--what do they find so offensive about them? Does it really bother them that there are men out there who know how to get a woman to sleep with them without making a six-figure salary? If so, then they've just exposed themselves as not being true believers in equality. If not, then they're just butthurt that women are no longer the ones who totally control the mating game, in which case they've again exposed themselves as against true equality.

Richard, I think you've rekindled my interest in the field. Do you have any recommendations for PUA writers to read, or websites to view?

Quote from Marx

Ranty McRant's at it again!!!

This one was pretty bad, I have some moral issues with some PUAs(Roissy comes to mind). I decided to leave it alone.

Quote from Phil Henderson

Does it really bother them that there are men out there who know how to get a woman to sleep with them without making a six-figure salary?

It doesn't bother me, but then again my main attraction goes against the normal grain.