MOTHER nature made those rules, Jools.

Do you think it is wrong for a woman to want to have a baby at say '41 or 42 or 43'?

What has 'want' got to do with it?

Quote from Percy

MOTHER nature made those rules, Jools.

What has 'want' got to do with it?

Oh,. I forgot I wrote the word want. But what if she can? Do you think in your 40's is OK?

Oh, what on earth am I asking you for. You've probably been fit and healthy to have a baby far later than that.

But I suppose the stretch marks would be bad for a woman. I've got the tiniest of them and you would never notice them if I didn't point them out.

Quote from julie

I think everyone here gets that women outlive men on statistics.

But now I wonder why society is Ok with men being older fathers and yet it shuns older women being mothers?

OK, so it says men have a biological clock at 50 and women have a biological clock at 35 but what if a man becomes a father at 65? We don't say, "What a sick man" but we do if we see a woman being a mother at '65'.

So what do you think is acceptable for men and is acceptable for women? Do you think it is wrong for a woman to want to have a baby at say '41 or 42 or 43'?

Do you think we should have one rule for men and another for women or as one can also put it one rule for women and one rule for men?

Women aren't supposed to be having babies at old ages. Men find young chicks attractive, as it means they are better for reproducing. Men don't have this problem.

Quote from Billy

So, you're worried that there isn't enough time to have my baby Jules? {{{Snickers}}}

Mother Nature is a dictator

Yes, I sort of wasn't thinking about mother nature. I am just wondering. I think now that my boys have grown I am getting clucky again.

nature dictates that wimyn become menopausal in their 40's their eggs have deteriorated;

their babies have a risk of Downes Syndrome

men on the other hand can remain potent even into their 80"s producing beautiful healthy children with young wimyn

yup !

its nature not a trendy feminit "demand" that nature will adapt to

some Italian wimyn had a baby at 60

when the child is 10 she will be an anile 70 - osteoporosis rhumatics dementia

when the child is 20 she is in a kommode at the nursing home and may not even recall anything at all

nature set wimyn's menopausal clock not the patriarchy

Offspring of older mothers face increased risks of complications; offspring of older fathers don't. Also, society considers mothers to be of greater importance to children than are fathers; hence, they worry if a mother is most likely not going to be around to see her children grow up, but not vice versa.

I'd say this 'phenomenon' is more a slant on men, than on women, as it undermimes their importance as fathers.

Just because men can reproduce into very old age doesn't mean that these much-older men are in good shape to be fathers. You don't see too many 70 or 80 years old dads for several reasons- one, it would be somewhat difficult to for a man that old to get a 20 to 30 year old woman sexually interested, and two, men that old aren't generally interested in having kids. Taking care of children is a physically tiring thing! Besides, people generally want to be around long enough to see their kids' milestones, to care for them, maybe even be around to enjoy their grandchildren. On a less self-centered note and contrary to popular opinion, kids would probably like to have their parents around for awhile, too.

By the way, older men's sperm counts are lower ,and there is a growing body of research that is showing that it isn't just sperm quantity that decines with age, quality also declines- kids born to older men are at higher risk for certain types of disorders. These disorders differ from the types of disorders that children born to older mothers are at risk for.

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-155031807.html

Regardless of what some people may say, "nature" did not intend for elderly people (of either gender) to become parents. It is possible to do it, but that doesn't mean it's a great idea.

Just sayin'.

Oh...and why are people generally more supportive of the idea of older fathers vs. older mothers? I think it depends on who you ask. Ask a man and he'll generally lean toward the idea that older fathers have few problems, ask a woman- she'll tell you being an older mom is feasible.

Quote from julie

Oh,. I forgot I wrote the word want. But what if she can? Do you think in your 40's is OK?

Oh, what on earth am I asking you for. You've probably been fit and healthy to have a baby far later than that.

But I suppose the stretch marks would be bad for a woman. I've got the tiniest of them and you would never notice them if I didn't point them out.

As you ask me personally, Jools, I think a woman in her early 40's (the ages you itemised) can have a baby relatively safely if she is fit and healthy.

The baby however is, as DB pointed out, less likely to be fit and healthy. Indeed it is more likely to come into the world in a poor condition, perhaps even deformed.

Me making babies? No chance I'm afraid. I did not want to after around 45 as I was slowing down compared to my fabulous 30's.

As for a chap in his 70's being a father, I would not approve. His energy levels are likely to be far below that needed to be an effective dad. His children would be in their madcap and wonderful 9-13 age when he is in his eighties and he could not do them justice.

Also, as you point out, his gamete is not likely to be in any fit condition to provide a healthy baby.

The stretch marks are not an issue with me. I appreciate a fine body on a woman but 'on' is the operative word. The woman that I love, the human being, is a soul. She 'wears' her body and it wears like mine and anyone else's does. Out ! Her character is far more important - and attractive - to me than her body. Her soul, her spirit, her essence gets better and better if she cares for it.

How's your's by the way, m'dear? Were I there I might rub a little wrinkle cream on your tummy for you.

Quote from Incognito

By the way, older men's sperm counts are lower ,and there is a growing body of research that is showing that it isn't just sperm quantity that decines with age, quality also declines- kids born to older men are at higher risk for certain types of disorders. These disorders differ from the types of disorders that children born to older mothers are at risk for.

I may stand corrected, but I still doubt very much if there's as much risk to a baby from an old father, as there is an old mother.

I heard on the TV just a few hours ago that downs syndrome has increased by 70% over the last 20 years because of the increasing age of mothers.

Nature lays the rules down, I dont personally think age is as important as folk think, because "youth is wasted on the young" anyway!

I was a father for the first time aged 23, and the last time, aged 46..

In many ways I am a "better" father than I was when younger, but much of that is due to the fact that I have a lot of experience with youngsters now..

Older fathers are often much more secure and stable in their lives, financially and in other respects and many feminazi extremists seems to prefer older fathers because they consider them less likely to be over-testosteroned (for want of a better way of phrasing it..)..

Id say it is good to have at least a 15 year age difference between the parties, if you are a 45 year old man, go for a woman aged 30 or less..

If you are a 45 year old woman, I suppose you could try getting a man under 30 if you can!!

I think at least one of the parents needs to still have some fucking ability to think it is worth the bloody hassle of it all!!

One of the problems of having a breeding unit half your age is that when you are in your 40's, its like having another fucking child to deal with!!

Mind you, do women ever really grow up anyway?

Quote from dyslexic_banana

I may stand corrected, but I still doubt very much if there's as much risk to a baby from an old father, as there is an old mother.

The statistics that show such are pretty suspect from what I have noted..

Bearing in mind that most men have a "breeding period", any statistics that simply look at age but do not consider other factors that are possibly far more significant (such as WHY does a man not breed till he is much older than average?) cant be taken as evidence of much..

Good breeders dont take 30 years to get off the starting blocks do they eh?

Quote from haahoo

Mind you, do women ever really grow up anyway?

Hmmm. I think I grew up at 21. That's when it hit me that the world I thought and hoped for didn't exist. Then it was just getting on with it. I am not sure if that requires adults.

Quote from Percy

As you ask me personally, Jools, I think a woman in her early 40's (the ages you itemised) can have a baby relatively safely if she is fit and healthy.

Some seem to be able to. But maybe I should just wait for the grandchildren now. And enjoy a break.

The stretch marks are not an issue with me. I appreciate a fine body on a woman but 'on' is the operative word. The woman that I love, the human being, is a soul. She 'wears' her body and it wears like mine and anyone else's does. Out ! Her character is far more important - and attractive - to me than her body. Her soul, her spirit, her essence gets better and better if she cares for it.

You have a way with words dear Percy. It is nice to see people in a whole different light than just their exterior and it is nice when othesr think that way about oneself, me thinks.

How's your's by the way, m'dear? Were I there I might rub a little wrinkle cream on your tummy for you.

Hmmm, that sounds nice.