This is a discussion on Warren Farrell within the Chit chat (MAIN) forums, part of the General category; I noticed there weren't any threads on this Man. I read a short summary of "The Myth of Male Power," ...
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#1
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I noticed there weren't any threads on this Man. I read a short summary of "The Myth of Male Power," browsed his site and read a disappointingly short article on him at Wikipedia. I then went to Amazon looking for readers descriptions of the book. This one summed up my impression of Farrell's views. "13 of 26 people found the following review helpful: A mixed bag, February 8, 2004 Reviewer: A reader It was interesting to read this book and get a new perspective. The thesis can be summed up with this quote from the first chapter: "Feminism suggested that God might be a 'She' but not that the devil might also be a 'she.'" This is definitely true. Warren Farrell's book does a pretty good job of debunking the popular notion that women are the victims and men are the suppressors, but here is my two cents: the solutions he proposes, the issues he wants a Men's Movement to raise, are neither plausible nor realistic. I say "implausible" because while Farrell, three-time board member of the National Organization for Women, seems to have escaped the statistical and factual errors that plague modern Women's studies, he clearly has not let go of the biggest myth of the feminist worldview: that the traditional male role is evil and needs to become more feminine. Throughout the book, he discusses Stage I versus Stage II roles for men and women, and how women have moved to Stage II but left men behind in Stage I. The problem with this idea is twofold. First, Farrell's vision of Stage II has few--if any--distinctions between the sexes. This would take us right back where we started. Feminism has helped set the tone for what is and isn't politically correct, and as such they have effectively made "boys being boys" something politically incorrect. Women and men simply are not the same; there is plenty of evidence to that end. Second, Farrell's charge would imply that feminism has been a good thing. Visit a Women's Studies program on your college campus and see what feminism has resulted in: misandry, lying, a sense of anger over a nonexistent problem, and a scornful attitude toward women who feel a compulsion to take a more traditional role in their family. And I say "unrealistic" because, let's face it, we are not at a point where we can abolish our military. We cannot sustain the kind of infrastructure we'd need to institute all the changes we'd need to have this kind of gender conformity--and, as you can tell, I would hotly debate whether gender conformity is a good thing in the first place. And people who believe that sexual instincts should be "repressed" believe such because they have a serious instinct that the passages in the Holy Scriptures which prohibit fornication are divinely ordained, and they are not going to be convinced that religion should "progress" to focusing on the spiritual aspect of sexual relationships rather than on sexual repression. It is possible to cherish and enjoy one's sexuality while remaining staunchly monogamous, and except for the Episcopal Church U.S.A. (for which I hear a death knell in the very near future), I don't see most major sects agreeing with Farrell's goals. Would I recommend this book? Well, yes, I would. Obviously, I am far more conservative than the author, but despite the fact that I think he would do well to scrap a few of his lingering feminist ideologies, I think it's an excellent read. It's an interesting alternative point of view, even if it didn't convince me that Farrell's particular flavor of the Men's Movement is the proper route to solving the current gender gap. It's well-written and has lots of useful information." "The coward dies a thousand deaths the valiant do die but once." | |||
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#2
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I don't really know what to think of fellows like Warren Farrell. He is certainly in this game for the money, which discredits his motives a great deal. And being the past president of NOW makes him seem to me like he is Henri-Phillipe Petain, trying to run for the leader of France while ignoring the shame of Vichy France. He can certainly be used for many things, the money he makes from his books motivates him to do research and whatnot that men can pinch from him, but... I don't hear the racking sobs of guilt from this man for being instrumental in bringing the hateful ideology of feminism into so many men's lives. I fear that men like this will attempt to become leaders of men when they should be told that they have done plenty already...take a seat at the back of the bus, please. There are lots of men like this in the men's movement. It's good that they are here, but many of them profess how activist they were for feminism 30 or 40 years ago and they obviously have not in-depth looked at their own beliefs from back then. They seem to believe that the MRM has the same goal as feminism - same cake but with a different color of icing. Many of them think that they are the rightful ones to lead the MRM because of their "experience" with being a feminist activist in the past. They don't get it that if the Nazis had included the Jews in their plans, the Nazis would have still been evil. I think there are some men in the MRM who are living out a "mid-life crisis" and some are trying to relive their youth. Thanks, but no thanks. Back of the bus, please. | ||||
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#3
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How come The Germans are supposed to be pure evil/evil incarnate/evil in a cup/drippingly evil/evil,evil,evil,evil, but The Russians, Americans and British never get the same treatment? What about the two massive government induced famines in Ukraine, the incineration of Dresden and the vaporization of Nagasaki? The Communists and Allied Governments killed lots of civilians who were at least just as innocent as the Jews that died in Germany's camps were. In regards to freedom, certainly Communism is at least as oppressive as Fascism and Fascism existed in more countries than Germany. So, why the fixation on those people and on that time? Certainly, they do not personify evil, that is Satan's job.
"The coward dies a thousand deaths the valiant do die but once." | ||||
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#4
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You are exactly right. And that's why I say if the Nazis had included the Jews, they would have still been evil. Most people don't realize the evils of the Fascism of Italy and Spain. Most people don't know that Stalin was worse than Hitler... We assume that the Nazis were evil because of what they did to the Jews. Hell, the Allies didn't even really know about the Jews until 1945. (More Hollywood dramatization...) The allies thought the Nazis were evil despite the Jews! And they were! Therefore, men rallying for DV shelters for men are nothing better than Jews rallying to become part of the Nazi plan, still evil! That was my only point. We have to watch out for those "leaders" in the MRM who say they are fighting for "men's rights" and a better society, but are really only pushing the agenda into further government intrusions and further degredation of gender harmony. | ||||
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#5
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That was a good point. I thought Farrell was sort of pushing for the same thing. It's like he thinks we haven't done enough! I think the Evil part was just wartime propaganda. If you believe in Original Sin, then you believe that everyone has Evil in them. So, it's just a matter of degrees. Germany was supposed to be way to the extreme and the camps are supposed to have proven that, but it seems that they didn't, because we see similar behavior from all parties to the war, including the Jews. Furthermore, I got the impression that Germany probably intended to force the Jews out of Europe, but not kill them. However, with wartime pressures, "the unthinkable became thinkable," but not until 1941. So, we fight a war to push Germany towards barbarism, hand over half of Europe to Stalin and get FDR's precious U.N. What would of happened if we'd just minded our own business? "The coward dies a thousand deaths the valiant do die but once." | |||
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#6
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I agree.. I have read a good deal on ww2 and I believe there was lots of propaganda about the evils of Germany that went into the history books as fact. There were many different people rounded up and put in prisons that were not Jewish. Many died of starvation near the wars end because even Germans had little to eat too. How could they be so anti-Jew and have Jewish fighter pilots and Generals even. One such Jewish general surrendered in Holland in 1945. '1945 General J. Blaskowitz surrenders German troops in Netherlands 1945' Do the research and you will find that the Jews declared war on Germany before WW2. The Jewish Declaration of War & The Economic Boycott of 1933. The Jews hurt the German people. No I dont hate Jews, I just love the truth and know some Jews who seek the truth also. I think most of us here know our governments are full of it.
Thomas Jefferson once said "It takes time to persuade men to do even what is for their own good." Feminuts are stupid, throw some common sense at them. They won't know what hit them. | ||||
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#7
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I agree.. I have read a good deal on ww2 and I believe there was lots of propaganda about the evils of Germany that went into the history books as fact. There were many different people rounded up and put in prisons that were not Jewish. Many died of starvation near the wars end because even Germans had little to eat too. How could they be so anti-Jew and have Jewish fighter pilots and Generals even. One such Jewish general surrendered in Holland in 1945. '1945 General J. Blaskowitz surrenders German troops in Netherlands 1945' Do the research and you will find that the Jews declared war on Germany before WW2. The Jewish Declaration of War & The Economic Boycott of 1933. The Jews hurt the German people. No I dont hate Jews, I just love the truth and know some Jews who seek the truth also. I think most of us here know our governments are full of it. Thomas Jefferson once said "It takes time to persuade men to do even what is for their own good." Feminuts are stupid, throw some common sense at them. They won't know what hit them. | ||||
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#8
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Well, I'm glad I'm Free; I wouldn't want to live in a Feminist, Fascist, Communist or Theocratic Muslim State. So, I'm proud and grateful that those things are being/been defeated. Of course, our Freedom isn't perfect and is in constant peril. For example, Madonna (an Italian and French Canadian follower of Judaism or Jew) has built a career on denigrating Christianity. She regularly defiles sacred Christian symbols and leaders. Europe applauds her. At the same time, a historian who questions any of the core "truths" of The Holocaust is branded a criminal. Many of these people are actually in jail for doing nothing more than sharing their views on some aspect of The Holocaust story, that contradicts the prevailing opinion. I'm sure most people would find this hard to believe. So, here's a link to a story about it, from a source that most people trust. "British historian David Irving has been found guilty in Vienna of denying the Holocaust of European Jewry and sentenced to three years in prison." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4733820.stm "The coward dies a thousand deaths the valiant do die but once." | |||
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#9
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Well, I'm glad I'm Free; I wouldn't want to live in a Feminist, Fascist, Communist or Theocratic Muslim State. So, I'm proud and grateful that those things are being/been defeated. Of course, our Freedom isn't perfect and is in constant peril. For example, Madonna (an Italian and French Canadian follower of Judaism or Jew) has built a career on denigrating Christianity. She regularly defiles sacred Christian symbols and leaders. Europe applauds her. At the same time, a historian who questions any of the core "truths" of The Holocaust is branded a criminal. Many of these people are actually in jail for doing nothing more than sharing their views on some aspect of The Holocaust story, that contradicts the prevailing opinion. I'm sure most people would find this hard to believe. So, here's a link to a story about it, from a source that most people trust. "British historian David Irving has been found guilty in Vienna of denying the Holocaust of European Jewry and sentenced to three years in prison." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4733820.stm
"The coward dies a thousand deaths the valiant do die but once." | ||||
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