good reading!

Excellent stuff! The second best effort from the Christian position I have ever read. Still think Leon J. Podles' "The Church Impotent" ( the Feminization of Christianity) is the best ever. Still it is good to see a mature look at all the issues confronting men of the church. Had his blog up before, but it went away for a time?? Glad to see him back! Thanks Music Man!

I must confess that I too became very disillusioned when I noticed that churches and the different religions started promoting feminism and destroying the basic building block in society, the family..

Societies in the past have already learnt that lesson to their own destruction..

Tis a good article..

Really good. Food for thought....thanks mm

Wow, such high praise, I guess I should read them too. Be back later.

Um ok.

That articles are all about what "not to be". Any idea what it thinks we should be?

It had some good points but nothing we haven't read on here, not impressed.

Well I think Garak you worship the Cardassian faith. When humans of the Christian faith sound like MRAs in general, the time for change is one big step closer. Unfortunately there are too few of these men right now, but the preaching has started.

A Klingon would understand better.

Quote from Timocrat

Well I think Garak you worship the Cardassian faith. When humans of the Christian faith sound like MRAs in general, the time for change is one big step closer. Unfortunately there are too few of these men right now, but the preaching has started.

A Klingon would understand better.

Then explain it to me.

This guy says: "Don't be athletic and macho" and also says "Don't be a nice guy".

Ok, then what shall we be?

Klingons are a warrior race, they would kill him where he stands for telling them not to be "macho".

There are some great things about being a real man in the parts about charisma, intelligence(even though intelligent people a lot of the times over think social interactions which lead them to not being charismatic, which is a great turn off, but who overcomes this will be a great person in my books - I have this problem myself btw) and in other parts, but there also are mistakes.

For instance, natural selection makes women care about athletic stuff, about financial things. And about stoicism, I find that in a commited relationship, the man is the less stoic person and puts more into the relationship. The woman usually is less attached to it and you see this stuff when a relationship finishes. Usually men take more time to get over it.

I could write about my idea of what a real man is and what is attractive to me as personality traits in a guy, but I'll just be told that I have no idea what a man is.

I could write about my idea of what a real man is and what is attractive to me as personality traits in a guy, but I'll just be told that I have no idea what a man is.

Don't take offense, around MRA sites we pretty much don't allow women to define what a man should be. I'm sure you understand how feminist tampering with that definition has caused all kinds of problems. At some point men have to stop allowing women to define manhood, you do understand this don't you?

MM.2, Sir.

You do us proud bring us such a thoughtful piece.

Yes, Garak, some of what is said, is being said here, from time to time. As Timo acknowledges. This board has been struggling with some of these very matters.

This man has a clear view of man's relationship with God that some here might find hard to accomodate. But being a man is a struggle to accomodate a lot of things, and the Fundemental, most.

The excoriation the articles give to the Churches is justified. He shows the results of all the many mis-steps in the minefield and while we as varied men - and the Churchmen he seriously questions - can be blasted for intolerance and striving to be Inauthentic in place of 'better' men, his reliance on Humility is nuanced.

I like his 'paradigm' outlines. I have consistently pointed out that the Traditional had significant flaws, and he specifies them better than I could have.

I have tried in discussing aspects of the 'Code' to bring up some of the 'headings' we must consider, and this chap Anakin puts a particular flesh on the bare bones that I have outlined.

Overall though he asks the same question that runs throughout my recent podcast.

Who does the Grail Serve.

Quote from Garak

Um ok.

That articles are all about what "not to be". Any idea what it thinks we should be?

It had some good points but nothing we haven't read on here, not impressed.

That is the whole point in my book as everyone seems to yap about what a real man is:

Quote from RebelliousVanilla

There are some great things about being a real man ...

the author say sth similar as well:

I am not here to give Bible-believing men a list of do's and don'ts. Plenty of others already make a living doing that. My intention is provide a scriptural response to anti-male sexism. My intention is to proclaim the truth to the status quo and defend those who have been denied a voice for far too long. In this, I believe I am following the example of my Lord and Savior.

And while I won´t read the Bible quotes I liked the deconstruction of popular paradigms that exist for us.

Then explain it to me. This guy says: "Don't be athletic and macho" and also says "Don't be a nice guy". Ok, then what shall we be? Klingons are a warrior race, they would kill him where he stands for telling them not to be "macho". -Garak

My point above was on your , "Hoo hum the Christian guys are now saying much of we have been saying for a long time." As for your saying, "There isn't much from him except that we haven't been saying for a long time " I agree with you whole-heartedly.

Anakin Niceguy (the writer) is playing it safe in deconstructing all the silly ideas of manhood (in his mind). Deconstructionists do this because they are playing it safe and not presenting a target for others to judge them. In his case he believes in the Lord and so to counter him you would need to counter the Lord's ideas, and thus prove to be a non-Christian to do so, and thus show him (and others of his deconstructionist Christians wing) that there is no need to deal with you, as you are a non-believer.

This is what many men do in our age, present arguments from castles to shoot shots at other men's ideas from their bastions which no one can see on their perch high in the clouds.

The answers to why he is this way rest in a book, but I'll only PM you it, as I don't wish to undermine Christian unity to the cause to win an argument. The cause is great than winning this argument.

I read the articles, and yes, much seems about "what NOT to be/do etc..".. But, I also read further in the other entries he had on his blog and it started to look a more "pro-active".. His link to MGTOW sums up a lot of what we SHOULD be doing.. (If anyone is keen on the MGTOW ideas, which I think look good..)

I also particularly like his idea of the "deal" men can make with women..

One of two choices --- And dont try and take the best of both!!

Its easy to "rip up" ideas, its much harder to come up with new ones..

I think, if you look at the blog more, his suggestions as to what a man can do is shown pretty well..