Thread: Feminist utopia, social nightmare

http://www.renewamerica.us/columns/roberts/050118

At their core, all utopian movements seek to remold human nature. The Marxists demanded that the New Socialist Man place the interests of the state above the needs of the individual. And the feminist movement seeks to achieve a society in which the social and psychological differences between the sexes are eradicated.

But history reveals the populace inevitably begins to resist such extreme psychological make-overs. So the utopians soon look to the government for a solution. That entails placing ever-increasing power in the hands of petty bureaucrats.

When their policies begin to infringe upon individuals' basic civil rights, the utopians inevitably explain that the ends justify the means. Thus the totalitarian state begins to emerge.

Good find bola.
It's a pity Carey Roberts doesn't go on to consider what happens next.
Totalitarian states seem to manage perfectly well when times are good. As long as the masses are being fed and watered nobody wants to rock the boat. Sometimes they even welcome strict discipline - e.g. Singapore. Even North Americans will swallow any amount of propaganda if their comfortable lifestyle can be maintained.

It's hard times that produce change. The Roman Empire needed imported food and slaves like the US needs imported oil and workers. But supplies of resources are hard to manage and all those immigrants bring dangerous new ideas, British India springs to mind too.
Let's take the great Soviet experiment. It failed because it was not economically viable. Dependence on the state enfeebles the people and sooner or later the economy takes a nose-dive. Even the founders of the UK welfare state warned against this possibility. Correct me if I'm wrong anybody, but a change of leadership seems to come into the equation too. The new leader, who is faced with clearing up the mess, decides 'enough is enough'. So where's next? Mugabe's Zimbabwe? Kim Jong Il's Korea?

But to get back to the purpose of this board. I honestly believe that MRAs can learn much from history. A 'revolutionary' movement like F4J gains grudging sympathy in the media but only because it focuses on a very specific issue. Similar actions on behalf of a vague notion of men's rights could and would be easily be repressed.

IMHO, hope for the movement lies with the great mass of men, quietly and legally refusing to cooperate. This projection assumes that the leaders of the 'older and wiser' democracies will recognize that something is wrong and make the right changes to prevent total economic collapse. But don't bet your life savings on it. As zombiefarmer said, gold bullion might be a wiser choice. An even wiser one for men would be 'transferrable skills'. They're in your head until you die and when you die you don't need them any more. No wonder the feminists are hell-bent on wrecking boys' education.

In my adopted country, politicos in the far-off capital make grand pronouncements and enact new laws like there's no tomorrow. The media is full of it. People in the provinces just ignore 99% of it and live as they always have, depending on older and more valued means of survival. Call it PGTOW - people going their own way.

The feminist-marxist corpus is stale and corrupt but it's pandemic. It's infected such powerful bodies as the media. the aid organisations and the United Nations. However the cure is simple - just realise that it's self-serving nonsense, as all do here.

Yes, I know. An attempted synopsis of world politics in one post was a stupid idea. End of rant. Please join me in a rousing chorus of , "I will survive!"

Good find bola.
It's a pity Carey Roberts doesn't go on to consider what happens next.
Totalitarian states seem to manage perfectly well when times are good. As long as the masses are being fed and watered nobody wants to rock the boat. Sometimes they even welcome strict discipline - e.g. Singapore. Even North Americans will swallow any amount of propaganda if their comfortable lifestyle can be maintained.

It's hard times that produce change. The Roman Empire needed imported food and slaves like the US needs imported oil and workers. But supplies of resources are hard to manage and all those immigrants bring dangerous new ideas, British India springs to mind too.
Let's take the great Soviet experiment. It failed because it was not economically viable. Dependence on the state enfeebles the people and sooner or later the economy takes a nose-dive. Even the founders of the UK welfare state warned against this possibility. Correct me if I'm wrong anybody, but a change of leadership seems to come into the equation too. The new leader, who is faced with clearing up the mess, decides 'enough is enough'. So where's next? Mugabe's Zimbabwe? Kim Jong Il's Korea?

But to get back to the purpose of this board. I honestly believe that MRAs can learn much from history. A 'revolutionary' movement like F4J gains grudging sympathy in the media but only because it focuses on a very specific issue. Similar actions on behalf of a vague notion of men's rights could and would be easily be repressed.

IMHO, hope for the movement lies with the great mass of men, quietly and legally refusing to cooperate. This projection assumes that the leaders of the 'older and wiser' democracies will recognize that something is wrong and make the right changes to prevent total economic collapse. But don't bet your life savings on it. As zombiefarmer said, gold bullion might be a wiser choice. An even wiser one for men would be 'transferrable skills'. They're in your head until you die and when you die you don't need them any more. No wonder the feminists are hell-bent on wrecking boys' education.

In my adopted country, politicos in the far-off capital make grand pronouncements and enact new laws like there's no tomorrow. The media is full of it. People in the provinces just ignore 99% of it and live as they always have, depending on older and more valued means of survival. Call it PGTOW - people going their own way.

The feminist-marxist corpus is stale and corrupt but it's pandemic. It's infected such powerful bodies as the media. the aid organisations and the United Nations. However the cure is simple - just realise that it's self-serving nonsense, as all do here.

Yes, I know. An attempted synopsis of world politics in one post was a stupid idea. End of rant. Please join me in a rousing chorus of , "I will survive!"

I feel often that way. What makes it even worse is the depressing realization that most men cheerily collaborate on their own subjugation or at least shrug their shoulders over it. Some men here and there grumble, but most of them don't seem to care. That makes me wonder why I should care. Staying out of trouble is my first priority. And spreading the word. The more men wake up the better. Most of the time you'll just get ridiculed though. Ah well... at least they can't say we didn't warn them.

I feel often that way. What makes it even worse is the depressing realization that most men cheerily collaborate on their own subjugation or at least shrug their shoulders over it. Some men here and there grumble, but most of them don't seem to care. That makes me wonder why I should care. Staying out of trouble is my first priority. And spreading the word. The more men wake up the better. Most of the time you'll just get ridiculed though. Ah well... at least they can't say we didn't warn them.

Quote from bola

I feel often that way. What makes it even worse is the depressing realization that most men cheerily collaborate on their own subjugation or at least shrug their shoulders over it. Some men here and there grumble, but most of them don't seem to care. That makes me wonder why I should care. Staying out of trouble is my first priority. And spreading the word. The more men wake up the better. Most of the time you'll just get ridiculed though. Ah well... at least they can't say we didn't warn them.

Exactly! Secure yourself first. Then the ridicule falls like water from a duck's back. Who will have the last laugh?

Quote from bola

I feel often that way. What makes it even worse is the depressing realization that most men cheerily collaborate on their own subjugation or at least shrug their shoulders over it. Some men here and there grumble, but most of them don't seem to care. That makes me wonder why I should care. Staying out of trouble is my first priority. And spreading the word. The more men wake up the better. Most of the time you'll just get ridiculed though. Ah well... at least they can't say we didn't warn them.

Exactly! Secure yourself first. Then the ridicule falls like water from a duck's back. Who will have the last laugh?

The flaw in the Franco-German socialist philosophy that the political left has adopted, and why it is always doomed to failure, lies in a misunderstanding of human nature: It wrongly assumes that human beings are fundamentally "good", and therefore perfectible. That this is untrue was self-evident to the British philosopher John Locke as well as to the founders of America, which is why the US government was based a system that sought only to facilitate resolution of interpersonal disputes, and did not attempt to end them.

Socialists, in their attempts to perfect humanity, keep colliding with our fundamental selfishness, which they insist is a result of our ignorance, not our fundamental nature. So they seek to "educate" us, that we may fit their image of perfection. The problem is that perfection means different things to different people, so that government must enforce a common definition of perfection. But the only way do that is through coercion, and the definition is necessarily determined by whomever controls the government. Socialism is therefore an inescapably tyrannical system, a trait that history has so frightfully proved.

The flaw in the Franco-German socialist philosophy that the political left has adopted, and why it is always doomed to failure, lies in a misunderstanding of human nature: It wrongly assumes that human beings are fundamentally "good", and therefore perfectible. That this is untrue was self-evident to the British philosopher John Locke as well as to the founders of America, which is why the US government was based a system that sought only to facilitate resolution of interpersonal disputes, and did not attempt to end them.

Socialists, in their attempts to perfect humanity, keep colliding with our fundamental selfishness, which they insist is a result of our ignorance, not our fundamental nature. So they seek to "educate" us, that we may fit their image of perfection. The problem is that perfection means different things to different people, so that government must enforce a common definition of perfection. But the only way do that is through coercion, and the definition is necessarily determined by whomever controls the government. Socialism is therefore an inescapably tyrannical system, a trait that history has so frightfully proved.

Really? Then why do I get the distinct impression that government here in the Netherlands is now more oppressive than in the "socialist" 70's? FYI, politics in the Netherlands has shifted inexorably to the right over the last 3 decades, like it has in many other countries.

Really? Then why do I get the distinct impression that government here in the Netherlands is now more oppressive than in the "socialist" 70's? FYI, politics in the Netherlands has shifted inexorably to the right over the last 3 decades, like it has in many other countries.

Gentlemen please! What has the 'colour' of the government got to do with it? A brief look at North America or the English-speaking former British Colonies (and some of the Dutch & some of the Spanish) will quickly yield the answer - bugger all.

Whatever the ideology, poor nations are controlled by guns and bombs. Rich nations are controlled by the law and the media.

Some American commentators belive that voting 'Republican' is the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything. If we want to go down that simplistic road, I'm sorry I mentioned the Marxist connection.

We're talking about anti-misandry here, a feminist tool. There are some highly-politicised women who ride the Marxist-Socialist tide, but they'll get into bed with the Right too if necessary.
Being the 'leader of the band' is more important to some than making good music.

Gentlemen please! What has the 'colour' of the government got to do with it? A brief look at North America or the English-speaking former British Colonies (and some of the Dutch & some of the Spanish) will quickly yield the answer - bugger all.

Whatever the ideology, poor nations are controlled by guns and bombs. Rich nations are controlled by the law and the media.

Some American commentators belive that voting 'Republican' is the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything. If we want to go down that simplistic road, I'm sorry I mentioned the Marxist connection.

We're talking about anti-misandry here, a feminist tool. There are some highly-politicised women who ride the Marxist-Socialist tide, but they'll get into bed with the Right too if necessary.
Being the 'leader of the band' is more important to some than making good music.

Quote from the sad geek

Really? Then why do I get the distinct impression that government here in the Netherlands is now more oppressive than in the "socialist" 70's? FYI, politics in the Netherlands has shifted inexorably to the right over the last 3 decades, like it has in many other countries.

I oppose coercion of all kinds, whether from left or right. It's just that in the 20th century, the vast majority of it came out of the socialist experiment. Hitler may have been to the right of Stalin, but they were both socialists, and both murderers on a grand scale.

But my point lay not in that, so much as in the error inherent in the Marxist assumption of human perfectibility. It invites tyranny and oppression by necessitating a large state apparatus. And once the state appratus is in place, anybody with an agenda to enforce can use it.