Thread: The Office of the Leader of the Men?s Rights Movement / Who Should Be Leader?

I agree that we should be unified but I think it is too soon for a formal leader. We must start the unification process fist and let the natural leaders come forward before we choose one.

We have had so many discussions like this. It's like we think we can herd enough cats into a room to "elect" a leader. We need to get our shit together and stop fighting with each other, before we can think about a leader.

And by the way, leaders aren't elected. They go out and achieve. Once they've accomplished something, they become an authority on that thing. Others then follow their example.

See how leading means getting others to follow your example? A "leader" is not someone who leads an organization. We already have organizations, and they accomplish very little. We need leaders, plural. Individual MGTOW who go out and make the world a better place. When we look inside our own souls for the true leader, the cream will rise to the top.

perhaps luke feels he should be the leader?

feminism never really had a leader, and yet it now dominates the countries it inhabited.

I will lead you..

My first task is one of delagation..

Work out what you would like me to tell you to do!!

Quote from Fruit_Cake

perhaps luke feels he should be the leader?

feminism never really had a leader, and yet it now dominates the countries it inhabited.

No Fruit Cake, if you read my blog entry, I never said that I thought that I should be the leader, and I clearly state that I think that Masculist Man should be the leader.

Unfrotunately, Wordpress's RSS is an atrocity and only gives the first 2 1/3 lines of the post (among other flaws that it has) and there's nothing I can do about it until they fix it in their next version (if they fix it, which hopefully they will). You guys are just going to have to be thorough and read my whole posts before coming to judgments on them.

Also, there is no reason why we should have the same organizational structure as feminism. In fact it would make sense for us to have a different organizational structure than feminism because in order for us to defeat feminism we will have to become more powerful than feminism, and a good way to do that is to have a more powerful organizational structure.

One of the roles of a leader is that he/she sums up the balance of opinion etc and presents it back to those he is "leading".. the purpose of that being to unify..

We see in the feminists a few spokespeople, but the philosophy seems to not have a leader as such..

Men like the hierachical stuff, it seems, but there are areas of expertise that are understood by very few in our area other than those who are dealing with them.. And in many cases, I fear that there are too many blind alleys that are taking all the attention..

Men need the common ground to unite under and agree on..

Looking at, say, the Equal parenting groups we have a whole sector of the mens "rights" arena that is operating in a blind alley and wasting massive amounts of energy as it refuses to see the crippling underlying factor of feminism and the futility of seeking "equality"..

Unfortunately, this area is very important as it addresses the major issue of A FATHERS ROLE in the family..

And, leading from that, the fathers role, the families role, in wider society..

Feminism has upset the apple cart, fucked up the vehicle and send the fruits of our labour scatterred across the street.. We must gather them, and consider not just returning the fruits to how they were arranged, but see how we can alter the vehicle and cart to resist/avoid the destructions in future..

I have suggestions as to how men can have a template for a society that embraces much of what men feel is needed, that gives them the ability to perform the role they were born into naturally and also suits women..

There is room for both feminists and "traditionalists" as we could call them, side by side..

But they need to exist within a template for society that allows for freedom, provides basic needs and respects natural roles.. Their is no shortage of wealth and resources to go round in the West at least, it is the problem that they are being squandered that makes feminism so obscene and destructive.. Paradoxically hurting those it seeks to empower!

Two key issues are..

1. Complete Rejection of the state "meta parent".. In other words, no more messing with more and more ludicrous and unnecesary laws to try and create a utopian "equality". We are not hermophradites.. we can never be "equal"..

2. In order to bring down the "decisive process" to the appropriate level from the state down to the family, we need the concept of "family head".. That is , under marraige, naturally a role taken by that member of the family best equipped by nature and god for doing so.. The member of the family CHOSEN for his abilities to do such by the CONSENTING member of the family that is likely to be sidelined in the vital business of CHILD RAISING (breastfeeding, etc) periodically.. I guess that means father heads the family! (unless its a genuine single mother headed household, with no natural father and no marraige..)

I agree Drex I got into antifeminism because of wanting equal rights for me and my children but I realised that there had to be a root to the problem and I found it. Obviously the answer was feminism. But I do think that one of our key arguments or selling points should be the parents issue because it is the one most undecided people will get behind in my opinion anyway.

Quote from chevalier

I agree Drex I got into antifeminism because of wanting equal rights for me and my children but I realised that there had to be a root to the problem and I found it. Obviously the answer was feminism. But I do think that one of our key arguments or selling points should be the parents issue because it is the one most undecided people will get behind in my opinion anyway.

The parents issue is indeed a very major one.. They fact that children haev two parents and they are different is the basis for everything that happens, the reason for opposite genders..

The problem with the parents issue is that its heavily in the "safe" zone of female dominance.. In the same way that the "war" issue is heavily in the male safe zone..

Battling for mens "rights" to ape women as male-mothers is as futile as women battling for their "rights" to be girl football players equal to men..

Quote from Drex

Battling for mens "rights" to ape women as male-mothers is as futile as women battling for their "rights" to be girl football players equal to men..

Interesting, I ws just thinking of how we could view, say, football as being better able to serve women..

The analogy is probably not a good one, but the women get lonely when they see men doing things that they cant.. they want to join in.. but they cant do it as well.. so they have their little ludicrous "girls football" teams that just dont compare to the mens..

Perhaps the purpose of football is to entertain, and increased gates and revenues show success and that feeds back to the players..

Womens role in football is to stand and watch, get to enjoy it, and maybe men benefit from that in the bigger crowds etc..

Looking at the EP groups, we have men who try to ape, copy and duplicate what women do so well as mothers..

Now, i am pretty skilled from my many years of being a dad, so I know probably more than the average mother, a lot more..

Like a female football commentator may have vast knowledge of the game..

But, I dont think men come across as being naturals in the female geared game of baby raising.. we just dont look right, we dont sound right..

But, the purpose of baby raising is to create the next generation, and men can support women in the same way that women support men in sports..

No point in making the big deal that men can do as well as women, when in the main, they clearly cant!!

There are basic gender roles in the main, and its a waste of time trying to alter them. because they dont need altering when the job has been done pretty well without statist intervention for millenia..

Women will hang onto their natural gender roles that they enjoy, and we as men should do the same.. Not reject our masculinity and try to bury it in fluffy bunny fur..

Our primary role is surely that of PROTECTION.. and of MANAGING the family affairs.. Women think very short term.. probably for good reason, babies dont wait to find out what tommorrow may bring, they need feeding and changing NOW.. The classic male approach to "heading the family" is.. "delegate as much as possible to mum.." while sir keeps a watchful eye..

And true equal parenting can only occur when each person has the natural right to excercise his/her natural talents with equal support..

Leadership is far, far more complex than some here imagine. It isn't about consensus or representing views, although that can be done when time allows. It isn't simply about achievement either, nor recognition of those achievements, though occasionally that happens. It isn't about personal qualities and charisma, although that sometimes comes into play. It isn't about authority, although it is virtually impossible without it. Authority is confered, not 'taken' or won.

Leaders don't always 'rise' to the top. Some lead from behind. Every action can lead. Action can also lead the wrong way. Every inaction leads the wrong way.

The form of organisation doesn't have to be 'better' than a prior standard. The feminists didn't have a leader nor an 'organisation' because feminism isn't a pro-active movement. It is a disease. A 'rot'.

Feminism is a lack. A lack of Truth. A lack of Justice. A lack of respect. A lack of understanding. A lack of common humanity. There is no leadership of a lacking of something. Where there is an abundance of those five things, feminism isn't. Where these things are allowed to diminish, feminism gains an inroad and flourishes. It is the decay of flesh in a wound. It does not need to be lead.

The counter to a wound or a disease takes great effort, some of which is counter-intuitive. Does the maggot placed in a wound to eat the decay and clean the flesh, exhibit leadership? Is the nurse who quietly bathes the wound with clean water and clean swabs, a leader? Is the field surgeon who is overtaken by hundreds of casualties and without sufficient equipment, who saws off legs to save lives and cries at his own inadequacies, a leader?

Every person here is a possible leader, undefined, inadequate, error-prone, human. Just not shoving dirt in the wounds would be a good start. Sorting bad apples from sound ones may be a boring task but a necessary one. Tending wounds with a loving heart does more than nothing at all.

BE Just. BE Truthful. Be respectful. Be understanding. Be Commonly Humane. Fill the cups and YOU are a leader.

A small list of issue that come quickly to mind.

1. These forums are filled with people around the world, so its hard to start local protests.

2. Resources. I have yet seen good local resource maps. With a list of of country/state/town and resources for men.

3. No fucking lawyers pretending to be mens groups.

4. Real life get together in person for people to talk.

5. Actual licensed, non-profit businesses in the mens movement. Promoting, getting people to join. (NCFM, and Justice 4 Fathers, etc) (Hopefully the MGTOW guys start thinking about it more)

6. FEEDER SITES. We need to promote mens issues more than 1 blog. I recommend we buy 1000 sites, link them all up, and do RSS feeds across them. And point the forums back to anti-misandry and mgtow. No google ads, sell stuff from men. Follow the porn example, feeder sites to get people to come back to the main sites.

7. Once sites are setup, get people to recruit men, send out flyers. Turn the RSS stories into newsletters. Create a world wide magazine for men.

8. Request colleges/universities to give credit to mens studies, validate the mens movement by colleges. Have PHD's write about MGTOW so we can get it on WIKIPEDIA.

9. Aggressive gorilla marketing at people getting married. Send the grooms information about mens rights and pre-nups.

10. Education for men, Have people goto schools. We need to get the information out to children, I'm sure there is legal ways.

11. Political watchdog groups to actually let men know of bills coming up, people in a certain state can "Call to arms" men in the local areas to fax/write/protest.

12. Reviews of men friendly lawyers, DV groups (as men are forced to go), Male friendly shelters, with info if possible to local support groups and websites.

13. Books, we need more MRA books. We need a MRA publisher, so we can crank out the books.

14. MRA's with money who can support the cause, we need to find men who are willing to back the groups.

and a million other things that we dont have.

Yes sir! those are fine ideas and thoughts. very good indeed.

A leader needs to be respected more than anything else.

Respect is rarely given to those who indulge in humour to the extent that I myself do..

And since i may love humour more than any "cause", I guess that Drex can never be a true leader..

But Drex is only a forum and web personality..

As is everyone here..

Till folk meet up face to face, we have a barrier to overcome..

Geography etc is a barrier to face to face..

The internet can be a place of creating links between men etc, but Its not really reality.

I often feel that I should ditch the Drex cyber character and re-invent myself as a more serious person.. One fit to lead..

But, I aint gonna lead losers.. And so far in my career with the cause, I have met many folk, and most of them are losers.. (sad to say..) they come to the field of battle from a position of defeat, and beg for "rights"..

They can get fucked with the feminists..

People only want rights when they have lost..

Losers get fucking nothing..

And if folk find my posts offensive, childish or whatever..

Then they should tell me to my face or as near as possible..

Then and only then, will I consider modifying my stance..

And that is of course presuming that they have anything useful and helpful to say..

No whinging..

This is a hard campaign for us all..

Leaders must be strong, and they must be backed up and respected..

They will emerge in time..

We must be in for the long haul..

This is not some fucking 3 year marketting excercise prior to fucking off and settling down with a nice single mother..

Could we have an area or thread that let other members know when we are traveling so that we can have meet and greets. I think you have hit on something[not someone] Drex. I also agree that family issues is a safe zone but I think that maybe that is still the best area to recruit new members and a good place to attack because our male leaders have to be at least a little afraid of losing their kids then again maybe not as most of them have older children. I guess I should ponder on it some more. I hate it when I get a thought about something while I am posting on it.

Sadly, too many are a wee bit paranoid about identity to meet up. It's a good idea though, I love meet ups.