Great suggestion.

Have a look at this thread: MRMUK - a good idea?

OK. Brainstorming Rule 1.

No idea is too bizarre, until all ideas are on the table.

Rule 2.

Reality sets limits.

Rule 3.

There isn't a rule 3.

Reality constraints:

Any organisation needs members who put in time and effort.

How much?

It needs specific skills.

Which are needed and which would be nice to have?

It needs Objectives. These can be many.

There will be Strategic objectives and Tactical ones.

Short term ones and long term.

Some objectives will need to be achieved before others can be.

What the organisation wants to achieve is best determined by exhuberance.

Objectives can be prioritised.

Not everyone will agree with every objective.

So, what Objectives do we want?

Organisations are People, writ large. People have skills, professional bents, and very importantly, personalities. All have to 'fit' specific roles and tasks. Some roles will be technical, some organisational, some physically demanding, some dangerous to one's personal/professional life. Some level of individual anonymity would be useful. Perhaps a cell structure.

Organisations need fuel - money. Lots of money. All 'members' need to commit to providing a token amount as a proof of commitment (IMHO) but this and charity is hardly likely to provide anywhere near enough to fund necessary full-time roles, part time roles and infrastructure. So we will have to find benefactors.

Benefactors need proof of capacity and surety of security for their support. That means a business plan, which will have an income generating aspect. A business plan needs to be presented personally, with data, by men of standing. It is a sales document. We ill need at least three benefactors of high financial capacity willing to commit several million dollars a year each for say, five years.

Organisations need leadership. Successful leadership can only be democratic when there is a lot of spare time and no rush to achieve anything. Other situations require a chain of command that is rigourous. That needs loyalty and a sense that the Organisation has Worth beyond simple entertainment.

I used to select Officers and Aircrew in the RAF - that was many years ago. There were a couple of mandatory questions we always asked, one of which was "Are you prepared to Kill people"? I doubt that any of us on an MRO wants to literally rip some feminasty's throat out and eat her/his liver but we do need to know what we are prepared, as individuals and as an organisation, to do.

So, "Are you prepared to Ruin someone, to destroy their reputation, destroy their career, ravage their personal treasury, dispossess them"?

Another might be "Are you prepared to go to Jail for your beliefs and/or actions"?

F4J members took to the second with gusto. They didn't get too far into the first though. It WILL be necessary.

Such questions will sort out Officers from Troops, leaders from followers.

Further considerations.

Objectives determine Force Structure, and thereore the Organisation of effort and skill.

For example. The Theatre Objctive in the North African Campaign was to throw the germans out of North Africa. There was an extant Force Stucture of Army and Air Forces,age old tactics and existing weaponry available whcih could be adapted to desert warfare.

DavidStirling saw merit in devising an entirely new Force Stucture, comprising small teams dropped behind enemy lines to wreak havoc very quickly and disappear. It worked a treat. Units of ten men did more damage than units of hundreds.

So, what Force Structure would suit an overall objective such as 'Repeal Family Law and Eradicate the egregious wickedness of the Family Court'.

Clearly the Organisation would need a Political office and legal officers. It would need to develop strategies for arguing the case against the Family Court and Family Law and disemminate that arguement widely in the public domain. Publishing and Marketing skll would come to the fore as well as sound internet skills.

But there would be a need to subvert the main players and beneficiaries of the Family Court - the Judges and Lawyers. There would be a need for small, locally based 'hit teams' who would go after and neutralise individuals. These 'wins', at grat human cost to our targets, would need to be widely publicised to put the fear of God into the defenders of the system.

Political reputation would have to be destroyed. Targeted politicians would need to be 'outed' for their corruption. This may need some Gray or even Black propaganda. Psychological Warfare units would need to be created and tasked.

What I am suggesting is a 'Public' face and an underground militant structure that does the dirty work that allows the 'Official' MRO to make its case.

So, an MRO would have a clean, discussive, publishing, legal, 'front' and a series of tactical units that engaged in many different tactical schemes designed to bring about the 'conditions' for change. These units would need the protection of anonymity and secrecy.

Someone has to step up and take the lead. Well done Percy. I am good at taking commands.

Percy asks,

So, "Are you prepared to Ruin someone, to destroy their reputation, destroy their career, ravage their personal treasury, dispossess them"?

I don't think we have choice.A few for the survival of many.

Another might be "Are you prepared to go to Jail for your beliefs and/or actions"?

Yeap.But I would prefer not to.

I will ask others to come from other sites.

I am hoping this is open to both sexes.

Any such organisation would need some selection process.

Perhaps someone could think about that and make some suggestions.

The internal structures and processes would not be general knowledge. While general discussion, even target identification, could be found on general discussion boards, I would envisage such boards - like this one - to be dissemination of results points rather than strategic planning forums. I cannot envisage specific organisational matters or specific objectives discussion going on in public, other than Overall Aims.

While many could be called, only a few would be chosen.

That would have to be off-board and by invitation. People could put publicly themselves forward of course.

Women, Julie? There are many fine and competent women in the MRM, doing fine work. We need intellectuals and balanced individuals who work hard, who see matters not in gender terms but in Truth, Freedom, Justice and Equality terms, as well as fighters and protesters, strategists and communicators. These all need to prove themselves over time.

There are some women around the MRM I would not trust. There are more than a few men too. There are a lot of wild-cards. Most however could be usefully employed in controlled roles. Their proof of usefulness may well be in their ability to take orders and fulfil intents without going beyond what is determined for them to do.

One selection criterion could be proof of action at local level. Another could be adherence to core Principles.

Another might be a repudiation of ANY gender-based drive be it nascent Feminism or 'Men's 'Rights'. Gender is Plumbing, not Principle.

But that is getting ahead of ourselves.

What an MRO needs, and can be discussed openly, is some Major, very broad Objectives and determination of Core Principles. Maybe four or five Over-arching objectives to do with major themes, such as:

Overthrowing and replacing Family Law with something more equitable;
Exposing the Education fiasco and driving out the Marxists-Feminists; Overthrowing the various strands of 'Affirmative Action in business and Industry; and
Putting "Women's" Rights into a dark dustbin, politically.

One Strategic Initiative that could aid us is a concerted attack on Individual mega-Organisations such as Universities, Cities, Public Departments at local, State and National level, with the intent of Damages Suits against them. They are well defended with armies of lawyers and swim in money. We will need our own tame legal carrion. I am all for trained Eagles launched from our arm to tear and gouge our targetted prey. I am even happy to see them make a good living from it and eat some livers!

I would see a subsidiary objective of having our own Law Firm within the first two years. This would be one of several commercial businesses we would need.

A central feature of an effective MRO would be the generation of $10 million pa in damages claims through the criminal and civil courts. One, two or three large wins by individuals or Class Actions would send shock waves akin to a Nuclear attack. That's in the first year. I would seek targets up to $100 million in five years.

For instance: the Duke case is happening. If this was with an MRO instead of driven soley by the families involved, huge public benefit could be derived. The families and the Duke boys have every right to sue on their own behalf of course and more power to them and have the resources to do it. But there are a thousand other egregious cases that NEED an effective and well resourced organisation simply to get off the ground.

There was that Sgt Mountie reported here the other day who won five million after many years of struggle. He could have had 25 million in half the time with a well resources MRO behind him. His half would have been 12.5 instead of 5.

Hence my previous suggestion for a high level Income Generating Objective. And initial 'seed' benefactors who could expect a return on their generosity. I would be seeking a financial 'snowball'.

I ask you, do you think the Duke case would have got up at all, going after the City, the University, individual Public Office holders and the like if the resources being used were not pretty well guaranteed a result? If each of those boys doesn't get ten mil apeice from it, after costs paid back, I would be astonished. Their parents have connections that have allowed them to amass the millions needed to take on a city and a University.

Believe me, THEY WILL WIN TENS OF MILLIONS.

An MRO would make sure every media outlet was bombarded with information. There would be no Public Office holder unaware that they, personally, will be screwed into the wall and bled dry.

Smaller, local organisations could be subjected to attacks too. I would see that as a sort of 'training exercise'. Little damages monies could be achieved but many bodies paraded down the high street.

Organisations such as the 'women's shelters' that Terri Lynn Tersak wrote about last week on the Equality Network. The women involved need to be ruined. Their families need to feel the heat. Their friends need to be turned upon them. They should be known to everyone in their towns for the evil bitches that they are. Every City Councillor who voted monies to those hell-holes should be targets for destruction.

Bring a scalp dripping with blood and you will get an instant Warrant as an MRO NCO!

And if the Law shilly-shallies around, such people will have fury visited upon them by other means. There could be many a promoton up the MRO ranks. I am fully behind the idea of significant vengance being taken in order to provide lessons to others. I have no personal animosity. It will not give me personal satisfaction to see people ruined so long as it effects change.

Okay lets not get ahead of ourselves and keep things simplified. We'll go through the points step by step. This has to be comprehensible for average Joes.


What are our Main Regions of Operation?
Since Anti Misandry is a English language site and most people have english-speaking contacts, it'll be the Anglophone regions of America, United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, Ireland and New Zealand. So MRO offices need to be established there.


What Kind of People are Involved?
We need balanced individuals, professionals, intellectuals who work hard, who see matters not in gender terms but in Truth, Freedom, Justice and Equality terms, as well as fighters and protesters, strategists and communicators. The all fit specific roles and tasks and all need to prove themselves over time.
I imagine many will be volunteers as not everybody can be paid.

Regional groups will be set up for activism on a regional level.


What are the Main Objectives?
These objectives give purpose to the MRO.

- 1. Attempt to bring about a change in the law granting anonymity for men accused of rape, which should only be lifted if they are convicted of their alleged crime.
- 2. Attempt to bring about a change in the law making women-only electoral shortlists illegal.
- 3. Oppose plans to shut down all women's prisons in the UK.
- 4. Encourage public debate over the future of infant male circumcision in the UK.
- 5. Raise awareness about male cancers.
- 6. Ensure that the male victims of rape and domestic violence are acknowledged and given support.
- 7. correcting the laws which militate against fathers' rights
- 8. abolishing laws that give women unfair advantages over men
- 9. removing tax breaks given to hate organizations such as NOW
- 10. removing charity status given to hate organizations registered as charities
- 11. removing sexism and misrepresentation of men and women in the media
- 12. giving boys and girls decent role models
- 13. removing 'political correctness' vetting committees from within political parties
- 14. challenging ideological assertions that men are inferior to women
- 15. changing the education system in a way that will benefit boys as well as girls
- 16. fighting misandry in the media and in educational establishments
- 17. demanding fair trials and exemplary compensation for victims of false allegations
- 18. ensuring fairer representation of men's views in politics by lobbying politicians
- 19. Open Family Courts - the secretive, insidious practices of the Family Court must be revealed to the public.
- 20. No Quotas - Abolishment of all quotas which is a means to mostly give certain positions in society to women without them having Earned it.
- 21. Men receive no help from others in achieving high-end jobs and in the interests of fairness, neither should women
- 22. Close the Health Funding And Research Disparities
- 23. Restore Marriage Men pay a too high price with divorces (usually lose children, large chunk of monthly income goes to ex-wife, half of hard earned possessions is legally stolen by ex etc).
- 24. Punish False Allegations - the person who files false allegations must be punished and the identity revealed.
- 25. Ministry For Men and Men's Studies - One of the clearest and horrible examples of second class treatment is the lack of a Ministry For Men and Men's Studies in many countries where there is a Ministry For Women and Women's Studies.
- 26. Same Requirements for Women in all fields of work. Women should be bound to the same standards as men so you don't have less capable people doing a job they actually cannot do if the standards were the same.
- 27. Mandatory DNA Tests for Children DNA paternity tests must become a standard mandatory procedure with newborns so everybody knows 100% the parentage of children.
- 28. No Pussy Pass: hold women accountable for all their actions - The judicial system must punish women with the same harshness as men when they trespass the law.
There are many cases about female criminals that use the "insanity card", "psychological problems" etc as excuses to lower or undo punishment.
- 29. Abolish Alimony - also known as vaginamony, paying for the past usage of a vagina. After a divorce has occurred a portion of your income is forcefully taken (stolen) and given to your ex-wife.
- 30. Equal Influence by Fathers Procreation
- 31. Minimal or no Child Support that only covers the necessary basics.
- 32. Squeeze Feminism out of Law Society Feminism in Law Society is responsible for many draconian laws like false rape charges, divorce clogging family courts, corrupt marriage terms, custody battles, paternity suits, female biased legal system.
- 33. to assist the media in providing fair coverage to men's perspectives (the www.orgformen.com does this too).

For more inspiration you can visit this thread of Men's Rights Objectives.


Who are the benefactors?
This is one of the biggest obstacles. We need a buisness plan and big benefactors that provide the necessary financial capacity so the MRO can be professionally funded and run. Donations alone won't cut it. Which big companies can potentially be interested?

Men's Rights Objectives have a lot in common with Libertarians (small government, personal freedom and responsibility). Libertarian organizations in Anglophone regions such as the Libertarian Party of America, Libertarian Party of the UK could be used as benefactors.


How can you become a member?
Membership is free. Anybody can become a member regardless of gender, race. Loyal members who contribute well enough could be paid and gain a promotion. The core MRO members who run the MRO on a professional basis and work semi or full time are employed.


How is the organization run?
There will be a rigorous chain of command. Not everyone wants to appear in person so many will support the MRO virtually and with donations. This requires a high quality, attractive website which can accomodate lots of people.
Since this is to be a tangible organization there will be people who are employed by the MRO and they represent it in physical form. This requires offices in the aforementioned regions. Which people will fill these vacant positions?

Great start on a list of Objectives, Tyrael. There are probably 200 more to outline and work through and many will be location specific.

There is a hierarchy of objectives to consider too, as your 30 odd can be grouped (and expanded upon) and many will be small conrtibutors to larger, more global objectives.

Which are which?

Taking a miliary campaign as an example, one might have a strategic objective to Invade Europe and Recapture France. These large and overarching objectives need itemising first. Sub objectives will include mapping the coastline in great detail, - it actually took three years of intense effort and many dangerous operations - taking out specific targets, destroying specific bridges, capturing specific places, organising logistics, equiping formations, gathering particular intelligence, establishing resistance groups, etc etc. Some of these will be tactical, ie: how to, enabling, rather than what.

So: Make Health an Equally Important issue regardless of Gender.
May have 15 sub objectives dealing with specific matters including cancer rates and fundings, circumcision, information and service provision, all aimed at taking privilege and bias out of the system. And such would conform to the Principles that are not in terms of gender at all but in concepts that are common to all, such as I mentioned - Justice, Equality, Freedom and Truth.

People in power who support the bias and try to extend it need to be removed, by whatever tactical means are available. Identification is a Strategic matter.

We can take these objectives off the list.

- 5. Raise awareness about male cancers.

There is already a global movement on this one and the health departments in our countries are working with this. I can't see any of us getting enough money together to beat their future awareness campaigns.
- 7. correcting the laws which militate against fathers' rights

I am pretty sure there are good father's groups already doing that.

- 15. changing the education system in a way that will benefit boys as well as girls

We have people already working on that in NZ. I am sure the other countries will be the same.
- 19. Open Family Courts - the secretive, insidious practices of the Family Court must be revealed to the public.

We have that pretty much in NZ. Just no-one wants to use it.

I don't know about other countries.

- 22. Close the Health Funding And Research Disparities

Already being worked on.

- 25. Ministry For Men and Men's Studies - One of the clearest and horrible examples of second class treatment is the lack of a Ministry For Men and Men's Studies in many countries where there is a Ministry For Women and Women's Studies.

This from what I have been told has been on the table many a time. UK made their own. NZ is making their own. I would think that the other countries would also have something going.

- 30. Equal Influence by Fathers Procreation

I have heard of a movement in US on this one. There isn't one in NZ but I will look into it.
- 12. giving boys and girls decent role models

There is big youth programs happening in all western counties. Slow but happening. US model of how the blacks are doing it.

- 31. Minimal or no Child Support that only covers the necessary basics.

There are already groups people in Aussie and NZ on this one.

- 33. to assist the media in providing fair coverage to men's perspectives (the www.orgformen.com does this too).

NZ is covered on that too.

I am just wondering.

Isn't this what the Honor Network is doing. Bringing all these groups together?

And shouldn't we be working alongside these other groups or are we overseers of groups?

The reality is that there are not enough good hard working people to fill all the jobs that are required.

And just another thing.

If we were to contact all groups and find out there support, I bet we will find there are already politicians on our side. Heaps of them.

Feminists really are only a small minority of women.

I like the list in this thread better than that objectives thread I volunteered to organize. I put it into Excel and have been working on categorizing the different points, but I have to be honest. I don't think it's the direction we want to go. Saying things like Western women today are the most privileged group in the history of mankind, and housework is nothing today because of the contributions of men, for example, frankly sound like whines.

Are they true? Pretty much, yeah.

Are they constructive? Not at all.

They serve to set up a victim mentality, resulting in a lot of "That's not fair!", but no change. It worked for feminism because men loved women, saw that some of their complaints were legitimate, and took the necessary steps to set things right.

That won't work for us, gentlemen (and ladies). We have to present what CANNOT be refuted, twisted, buried, trivialized, or manipulated in any way that will give anyone an excuse to ignore it. We have some real, legitimate claims, and we're up against a system that is bloated with special interests, incestuous, and corrupt.

That being said, I am going to have a hard time coming up with resources and time to devote to the effort. I kinda promised I would be a wife and mom. I will help where I can, though, you can count on it. Just point me in a direction and give me a push.

Since this is about brainstorming, I would like to put something forward.

This whole movement is a huge movement, like a train as PaulP points out.

We are just one small group of people amongst all this. And I think being constructive is always a good thing. Else places like this site are nothing more than a chat site, which I think it was and should be. A place for men to speak their mind on issues. A support tool.

I think also that we do need to be realistic and look at the facts. MGTOW is about men doing their own thing.

When I look at this; I see a whole lot of men who are concerned, they are out of the matrix, and they have found ways to survive without getting focused on the world issues.

And then there are women who too have a life and many have children to consider and husbands and work.

So I wonder what can you do with all these people that is productive. Well, the first thing is not to expect much because they haven't got much to give. And to make what they can give; important.

And the truth is we do have constrictions. We do have strengths and we do have weaknesses.

Our strength is the Internet. And our weakness is that we are not together on the ground. Every group on the ground is begging almost to get men involved. And some of these groups are well organized and have a great reputation because they have succeeded in time. We do not need to compete with them but should support them and give them the people that want to help.

The Internet for us, here and now, is the tool to focus on.

Maybe we need to become as organized as Radar is.

Even Kelly who gives alot of time can't get out there and go to prison. So maybe prison is not the answer. Maybe leave that to the guys who are fighting from pain at the moment or who are able to lose out because they have already lost everything. What else can they lose?????

Should we start off as something small just like Tyrael asked from us in a previous post. Find a way to hit back through numbers.

The PUA sites ask, what can we do? Other sites ask the same.

These are your men. What is your answer to them?

Why not look at a way for them to complain through the Internet.

I have a single parent's trust. Everyone wants to give but I don't have the time to use this resource. And why do they want to give?

Because I ask little form them. And if they want to give more then I let them. I tell them to go for it. Give your expertise but stay in the boundaries of what the entity is about. They love it.
This is the norm for non monetary organizations now a days. Let people give their best. They get something, the movement gets something. And we should give something worthwhile to them. We should become references for them to use in the future.

You have the numbers. You have had them for a long time.

You just need to focus on what you want to do with what you have. Instead of asking what you have to be something it is not.

Gosh, I hope I make sense.

Look at it this way, HOW DO YOU MOTIVATE PEOPLE

Answer: Don't dictate to them something they don't want. But help them get what THEY want.

Saying things like Western women today are the most privileged group in the history of mankind, and housework is nothing today because of the contributions of men, for example, frankly sound like whines.

Are they true? Pretty much, yeah.

Are they constructive? Not at all.

They serve to set up a victim mentality, resulting in a lot of "That's not fair!", but no change.

Call a spade a spade. Or a shovel, if you will. But let's not pretend it is a feather duster.

Men ARE victims, women are NOT. Men are systematically hit, hard, wherever they turn. Women have 'captured' the word just like the Communist lackies captured 'Peace'.

Calling it 'victim' does NOT set up a victim mentality. It creates righteous anger and the motive to change. It is not a 'whine'. That's what Feminists do. It recognises a truth, just as you point out Kelly. Calling the Truth, a 'whine' is playiing to falshood. It is Denial. And Shaming.

Is is constructive? It clears away verbal rubble to allow building to occur.

Part of the problem we face is the inertia caused by men reading the situation the way Feminists constantly tell it. Men do not complain anywhere near enough, many being convinced that they 'oppressors' because that's what they are constantly told.

I have even had a 15 year old boy 'admit' that he was an 'oppressor of women'. I had to point out to him that the only woman he knew was his mum and he did what she told him to do.

When the majority of men see the writing on the wall rather than having the distortions read to them by women, then change will occur. Meanwhile do not put them off seeing the truth and telling it.

Quote from Percy

Call a spade a spade. Or a shovel, if you will. But let's not pretend it is a feather duster.

Men ARE victims, women are NOT. Men are systematically hit, hard, wherever they turn. Women have 'captured' the word just like the Communist lackies captured 'Peace'.

Calling it 'victim' does NOT set up a victim mentality. It creates righteous anger and the motive to change. It is not a 'whine'. That's what Feminists do. It recognises a truth, just as you point out Kelly. Calling the Truth, a 'whine' is playiing to falshood. It is Denial. And Shaming.

Is is constructive? It clears away verbal rubble to allow building to occur.

Part of the problem we face is the inertia caused by men reading the situation the way Feminists constantly tell it. Men do not complain anywhere near enough, many being convinced that they 'oppressors' because that's what they are constantly told.

I have even had a 15 year old boy 'admit' that he was an 'oppressor of women'. I had to point out to him that the only woman he knew was his mum and he did what she told him to do.

When the majority of men see the writing on the wall rather than having the distortions read to them by women, then change will occur. Meanwhile do not put them off seeing the truth and telling it.

I can see that what I meant was not quite what I said. Yes, you're right, Percy. I didn't mean to say that men aren't victimized; clearly they are. I guess the point I was trying to make was that there's a difference between a general, somewhat vague complaint, and irrefutable Truth. Sometimes it's easier to think of yourself as a helpless victim than to take concrete action. In fact, most of the time that's the easier way to go.

I'm sure that my own experience is coloring my perception, but I know how deadly depression can be. First you get mad. Then you get depressed. Then you get apathetic. Trying to get moving again after that is just so damn hard.